Is It Illegal For A Player To Blitz Moves On The Opponent's Time?

Running Chess Tournaments
21

I have seen this many times. But in my weekly tournaments, 75% of the players are children (maybe more than half 8 or under) and 1/2 of the players are rated below 750. And I don’t run blitz games, so I don’t have to worry about those variations. And while this and the thread from 2022 are conceptually interesting, I didn’t see the objective or even the recommended, consensus answers to real-life cases:

  1. White makes a move and sits there. In fact, White almost never pushes his clock. If Black makes a move, are you going to interfere and tell him to wait until White finishes or will you let the game continue?

  2. And if you do interfere, are you going to wait there and interfere after every move because White still will not remember to push his button.

  3. White makes his move and it’s Black’s turn. Black thinks and decides what to do but his opponent’s clock is still running. He pushes White’s clock, makes his move, then pushes his own clock. This is not rare. What do you do?

  4. White is running out of time and Black plays moves before White can push his button to prevent from White getting the 5 second delay. To me, that’s as bad as the guy who touched the piece and moved something else and will frustrate kids and drive them away.

Are we in favor of training the players to sit indefinitely and wait for the opponent’s clock to run out instead of playing a game? Okay, that’s legal. I’m glad it’s not happening in my tournaments because I want the kids to enjoy the game and continue playing, not chase them away.

And if you let someone touch the pawn then move a different piece after the opponent pushes the button, then you’re teaching them that manipulating rules trumps playing the game. One player learns to look for ways to mis-use the rules. The other gets angry, the parents get angry, and they decide to go play a different sport because they feel cheated. It can be technically correct — and also be a morale-buster.

22

Ok, so a move is made when:

made: 1.1. A move is said to have been ‘made’ when the piece has been moved to its new
square, the hand has quit the piece, and the captured piece, if any, has been removed from the
board.

And completed when the clock is pressed:

completed move: 6.2.1. Where a player has made his/her move and then pressed his/her
clock.

Meaning that a player is on move after the opponent has made (but not necessarily completed) the move.

As compared to USCF:

6B. A player on move.
A player is said to be on move or to have the move when the opponent’s move has been completed.

Thanks for pointing that out; I hadn’t realized it.

EDIT: I assume this also feeds into when draw offers may be made / accepted as well.

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23

I was thinking specifically calling it out during the game – which I have never intervened during w/o a complaint. For sure in between round reminders especially when I have observed. I’ve noticed some players who seem to delay/hesitate pressing their clocks to cause some controversy – of course I can’t prove it.

This is another reason I like d10 vs d5 as players shouldn’t be tempted to move super fast (of course I have seen some not take advantage of the extra 5 seconds)

24

For USCF tournament games what do you do for a game where a player makes a move but doesn’t press his clock and the other player makes a move? Do you tell the 2nd player that he needs to not move until the first player presses his clock and that he is free to make any move he chooses after the 1st player presses his clock?

25

This was the whole premise of this discussion, which you linked to previously… Touch move by player who is not on move

However, since you specifically mentioned “Blitz” in the title of your post, the USCF Blitz rules does have Rule 15, “A legal move is completed when the hand leaves the piece.” So for blitz games the answer is actually the same as the FIDE Laws, the next player is “on the move” when the player’s hand has left the piece, assuming the move was legal.

In my humble opinion, USCF needs to change their regular rules on when a player is “on the move” to the same as FIDE’s, e.g. after the opponent had ‘made their move’. FIDE deliberately puts this in Article 1 because a clock only comes into the equation via the “Competitive Rules of Play” from Article 6 and beyond. The USCF definition of a player being on the move after it is completed by pressing their clock is irrelevant and very confusing if a clock is not in use. And yes, I’ve overseen USCF rated games without a clock being used.

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26

If we align with FIDE on Regular game rules, will all claims by a player to a TD have to come before a move rather than before pressing the clock? Are there any cases where claiming before moving will cause any claiming hardship?

27

It’s a can of worms question. The rest of the world deals with events using FIDE Laws and even here in the US, all FIDE-rated events have to use the FIDE Laws. Each set of Laws/Rules has its own nuances and issues and detailing every philosophical and handling of a situation difference here would take a long time.

However, to make this simple, as far as I am aware, the US Chess Delegates have no interest in adopting the FIDE Laws, so if you’re running US Chess rated events only, concentrate on what you have, and if there’s something you don’t like, you can always advertise and use your own variation locally.

28

When Player A makes a move and doesn’t press his or her clock and Player B waits and waits, is it considered helping Player A for the TD to tell Player A you need to press your clock? Is it considered a penalizing offense if Player A is continually forgetting to press his clock after moving?

29

That’s kind of the opposite situation as the one at the start of this thread, isn’t it? I doubt A not punching the clock is bothering B.

As the TD, am I going to tell player A to punch the clock? Not during the game.

If I was player B, I might point it out–once.

30

I can see that it could be a nuisance, but is there something wrong with Player B pressing the clock for Player A?

31

Without reviewing the rulebook, I can’t come up with any specific rule forbidding B from pressing A’s clock. Maybe others can come up with one?

32

Back before US Chess had the blitz rule that allowed making your move once the opponent has determined theirs, there was a Supernationals blitz tournament (2005 or 2009) where one team was coached to make their first move without hitting the clock and then claiming an illegal move win when the opponent moved (generally not realizing the clock had not been hit). It was granted by a few week TDs before the chief of the blitz heard about it and told TDs such claims would be rejected.

I have watched games between a 17xx player and a 21xx player (treat the 17xx player as having white for example purposes)

a) 17xx player makes move (z) and starts reaching for the clock

b) 21xx player makes move (z) and hits clock (which is still running on the 17xx side so the hit doesn’t do anything)

c) 17xx player hits the clock (for move z) as he is permitted to do, starting the 21xx player’s clock (for move z), and the 21xx player does not notice and fails to hit the clock (which the 21xx player is now entitled to do to complete move z)

d) 17xx player makes a move (z+1) and starts reaching for the clock

e) 21xx player moves (z+1) and hits the clock (finally completing move z starting the 17xx player’s clock for move z+1)

f) 17xx player hits the clock (for move z+1), starting the 21xx player’s clock (for move z+1)

and repeat. The 17xx player averages maybe 5 seconds between the start of a move and the hitting of the clock. The 21xx player averages maybe 1/2 second between the start of a move and the hitting of the clock. The 17xx player’s hits (for any move z) are generally about a second after the 21xx player hitting the clock (for any move z). Every 5.5 seconds sees one second go off the 17xx player’s clock and 4.5 seconds go off the 21xx player’s clock, even though the 21xx is only spending 1/2 second physically moving versus the 17xx player’s 5 seconds. Note that if it is a 3+2 time control then the 17xx player’s time is going up around 1 second per move while the 21xx player is losing around 2.5 seconds per move.

Eventually the 21xx player flags and cannot understand what happened, certain the 17xx player must have somehow cheated by manipulating the clock. Only understanding what happened after receiving a detailed explanation of what was witnessed.

In non-blitz games most TDs I know will apply touch move to overly quick movers even if the clock has not yet been hit. All TDs I know will still allow the clock to be hit by the slower mover, allowing players to receive any increment or delay. If the slow mover intended to make claims in the time between making a move and hitting the clock then such claims are still allowed and will temporarily disregard the overly quick response (if the ruling does not prevent the overly quick move from counting then that move is used and treated as complete - the clock should be restarted with the 17xx player’s side running and then both hit to trigger the increment/delay that has not yet been registered, also getting the move counter to count the last move-pair that was completed).