MOVED from USCF Issues: Karpov vs. Polgar

Of all the things you’ve said, Sam, I find it hardest to believe that Karpov would play 1 g4 against anybody, let alone a GM.
This is the man who thought he was being insulted when Tony Miles played 1…a6 against him (and won).

1 g4 gives White nothing but a bad game:

[A00]
[Nierman,Brenan]

1.g4 e5 2.Bg2 h5 3.g5 [3.h3 hxg4 4.hxg4 Rxh1 5.Bxh1 Qh4;
3.gxh5 Nf6 4.d4 exd4 5.Qxd4 Nc6 6.Bxc6 dxc6 7.Qxd8+ Kxd8 8.Nc3 Bf5 9.Bg5 Rxh5 10.0-0-0+ Bd6 11.Nf3 Kd7;
3.d4 hxg4 4.dxe5 Nc6 5.Bxc6 bxc6 6.Nc3 Qh4;
3.Nf3 Nc6 4.d4 e4 5.Ne5 hxg4 6.Nc3 d5] 3…Qxg5 Line

You apparently did not read the article in ChessBase about this game.

“President Gorbachev arrived at 4 p.m. and they were ready to start. Anatoly had white in the first game. Therefore, President Gorbachev would make the first move for Anatoly. As he arrived at the board, he told the audience that this is a wonderful match between two great champions. “I am going to cause some difficulties for the older player”, he said, then proceeded to play 1.g4 without asking Anatoly. Both Anatoly and Susan looked up at President Gorbachev in shock. Anatoly thought that the President was joking as Anatoly mentioned that he would like to make another first move. But the President was firm in saying there is no take back in chess. Then the players started their first game.”

So, Karpov won the game, which turned out to be the only game that Karpov won with white.

Later, Polgar said that she had lost because she was distracted by Gorbachev pouring a glass on water during the game. That was a poor excuse considering that Karpov is considered the better player and 1.g4 is just a good move. (Your lines above give Black nothing.)

Sam Sloan

No, I did not read the Chessbase article. But it turns out that Karpov did not make the move, so my belief in his sense of taste is vindicated.
At least Gorbachev knew he was making one klunker of a move. As Botvinnik maight say, “Every Russian schoolboy knows that 1 g4 is bad.”
Can you imagine what Kasparov’s face would look like if you tried that stuff on him?
Contrary to your assertion that my lines (which are really Pete Tamburro’s) give Black nothing, the only line that comes out with equality for White is 3 d4. In all other lines, Black already has an edge, or even a -+.
It would help, Sam, if you backed up your claims with some concrete analysis.

Please do not hold your breath. I engaged him in a bit of analysis on RGC WIin another of his ‘claimed’ playable lines, 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 f6. I continually busted his offered lines (like getting to endgames 3 or 4 pawns up) until he simply stopped responding (or perhaps he just forgot?). Of course, he kept claiming it was playable.

The more things change, the more things stay the same.

I won’t hold my breath. And I’ve got a good line against that ridiculous defense too!

Yeah, but we can’t continue this discussion or they will lock the thread (moderators, I am not complaining, I am acknowledging the need to stay on topic).

I think that the point Brenan brought up in an earlier post might have gotten lost in his other words. I want to highlight this point as I thought I remembered how it happened. Sam, unbelievably, got it wrong.

Gorbachev did make the first move for Karpov as 1. g4. However, after the humor of the situation where all got their laughs, Karpov corrected the first move to be 1. d4.

Every other source I have seen has said that the game was played with 1.g4 and it was not corrected to 1.d4.

I think that Polgar would not be making the excuse that she lost because Gorbachev poured a glass of water during the game if she had lost to 1.d4

What is your source?

Sam Sloan

Sorry Ron…simple Google search provides a ChessBase.com source. Chess for Peace with Mikhail Gorbachev, written by Paul Truong published on 02/11/2005.

Sidenote: I was amused by the second sentence of the article regarding peaceful resolutions.

Here is the key passage, found 2/3 down the page:

I suppose “shock” is as good excuse as any for losing a game to 1.g4, and “technical difficulties” with the sensory board is a good excuse for not having the game moves. And I wonder why the 6 blitz games aren’t in my CB or TWIC databases, even though GM Shulman kept the moves on a screen using Fritz.

Good point, thank you.

If the moves were put on a screen using Fritz, this means that they have the games recorded in a computer.

I believe that the other games were published somewhere. The only game that was not published was the game where Karpov played 1. g4 and won.

Perhaps we should ask Mr. Korenman that question since he was in charge of the event. Was the game where Polgar lost not published to save embarrassment to Polgar? (We have a similar situation with regard to the Exhibition Event at the World Cup of Football in Dresden, Germany in 2007. The three games played by Polgar in the preliminary round were never published, nor were the results ever revealed except that Polgar wrote that she “took it easy” to “conserve energy”. Does this mean that she lost one of the games? We have never been able to find out the answer to that question.)

Sam Sloan

How is any of this a “USCF issue”?

I stand corrected. I did say that I was going by my recollection only. I do recall Karpov asking for a different first move. That is where I left it.

Now as to Brenan claiming how bad 1. g4 is, well it ain’t necessarily so.

I play weekly with a friend that often plays 1. b4 as his first move. He has won quite a few games with this opening, even against a Master and a few Experts. That’s not too bad for a Class B player.

Also Sam Sloan played an Expert, Bill Brock, awhile back in a grudge match held in Chicago. People actually gave money to fly Sam to Chicago and have a $1000 prize to the winner. This was all done through the group on rgcp before this forum was even a twinkle in Mike Nolan’s eye. Anyway, Sam won that match. I might be mistaken but I think 1. g4 may have been seen by Sam in that match.

While the Grandmasters of the world will claim these openings are busted, it isn’t necessarily so in real play. Sure, theoretically that may be so, but let’s face it when playing over a chess board the practical often varies quite a bit from the theoretical.

That is correct. Not only did I play 1. g4 in the match, but I won the decisive game and $1000 by queening my g-pawn. Here is the game:

[Event “RGCP Grudge Match 2005”]
[Site “Bill Brock’s office in Chicago”]
[Date “2005.06.26”]
[Round “3”]
[White “SamSloan-1931”]
[Black “BillBrock-2042”]
[Result “1-0”]
[Opening “Grob’s attack”]
[ECO “A00”]
[NIC “VO.11”]
[Time “23:39:38”]
[TimeControl “4500+5”]

  1. g4 e5 2. Bg2 h5 3. d4 exd4 4. g5 Bb4+ 5. Kf1 Nc6 6. Nf3 Bc5 7. b4
    Bxb4 8. Nxd4 Nxd4 9. Qxd4 Bf8 10. Nc3 c6 11. Rb1 d5 12. h4 Ne7 13. Bb2 Qc7 14. e4 dxe4 15. Nxe4 Nf5 16. Qd3 Be6 17. Re1 Qd7 18. Nf6+ gxf6 19. Qxf5 O-O-O 20. Qxf6 Bb4 21. c3 Bc5 22. g6 Qd3+ 23. Kg1 Qd2 24. Rxe6 fxe6 25. g7 Rhe8 26. c4 Qe1+ 27. Kh2 Bd6+ 28. f4 Qd2 29. Be5 Bxe5 30. fxe5 Rd3 31. Rf1 Qe3 32. Rf3 Qe2 33. Rxd3 Qxd3 34. g8=Q Rxg8 35. Qxe6+ Kc7 36. Qxg8 Qf5 37. e6 Qf4+ {White wins} 1-0

Notes:

  • All Time Controls were really G/75 (+ 5" Bronstein).
  • In Game 3, Black resigned with 9 seconds left on the clock.
  • Arbiter Vince Hart and Official Scorekeeper Larry Cohen awarded the
    Best Game Prize, which was a copy of Benko’s Life Games & Compositions,
    to Sam Sloan for Game 3, for having delivered the best entertainment
    value.

Something to do with the “C” in USCF, I think :slight_smile:

1b4 is not the same as 1g4.

He should have played …hxg4. You played the best line white has, sam; but proper play by Black equalizes.

If elected to the board, I will consider a rule change to prohibit the use of 1.g4 in any USCF sanctioned event. :sunglasses:

Not sure I can vote for you, then. I WANT my opponents to play 1. g4. :slight_smile:

If you’re going to prohibit anything, make it the French Defense. :smiley:

– Randy “Needs To Learn Something Other Than The Exchange Variation” Shane

Ban the Smith-Morra Gambit. Though I don’t think Dr. Hecht would go for that since he’s beaten me several times with it. I guess I can’t vote for him. LOL

If you hate the Morra Gambit, you can always decline it and force White to play the c3 Sicilian. But you have to be comfortable with the …Nf6 version of the c3, not the …d5 one.
But taking the pawn is fun. It’s always nice when White shys away from the Open Sicilian and plays an inferior anti-Sicilian system. The only one to really pose Black trouble is Bb5 systems.
I like Bent Larsen’s comment in his annotations to a Ken Smith game from San Antonio '72. When Smith’s opponent, who was Mario Campos Lopez, played the French against Smith’s 1e4, Larsen gave the move …e6 a (?) and wrote, “Stronger is P-QB4, which wins a pawn…”